Shopping snobbery

One of my all-time favorite movie scenes to re-enact is from Pretty Woman when Julia Roberts, pre-makeover, is shopping on Rodeo and the snotty saleslady looks her up and down and sniffs, "I don't think we have anything for you. You're obviously in the wrong place. Please leave." Actually, I’m not heartless – the part I really like to do is the post-makeover scenario when gorgeous-but-now-proper Vivian returns, weighed down with couture shopping bags and delivers that trademark line every woman loves: “You work on commission right? Big mistake. Huge! I have to go shopping now…”

Is there any lady alive (rude salespeople excluded) who does not worship the empowering, confidence-boosting, you-go-girlness of that moment?

I was recently reminded of the Rodeo Drive beatdown when my mother recounted the following few anecdotes to me:

1) She was shopping for a gift in a popular department store, looking at dresses in the plus-sized department. A saleslady asked if she needed any help. “I asked if the dress that I saw was available in an extra-large versus a 1X,” mom recounted, “and she said that she didn't know if it came in a ‘normal’ size.” What?! “Then she clamped her hand to her lips and she said she couldn't believe that came out of her mouth.” (As a sidenote, my mother added that the lady herself was overweight, not super-svelte or anything like that).

What do you think the woman meant by “normal?” Clearly she mentally connects anything over the standard S/M/L/XL as being abnormal. This is sad on so many stages – on the individual level because, as a plus-sized woman herself, she perhaps considers herself irregular. And on the greater, societal level – she interacts with many, many women on a daily basis…who knows what else has come spewing out of her mouth?

2) Next, while in knitting class, mom and her fellow crafty ladies were discussing their looks (Grandkids? SO last decade!) “While we felt that none of us were drop dead gorgeous, we did feel that we were all attractive women - but so many of us have gone into stores to shop, and getting a sales person to help can be difficult, as though we were invisible.” Until – that is – “our teenage and older daughters came up to us and then help was plentiful.”

Any moms out there identify with this? Any women who work in the stores (I endured a one-month stint at The Gap in high school, it's true) and want to come forward and defend their behavior...or correct me?

BTW, I think that my mother and her knitting group were able to talk about these sensitive issues with such self-awareness, that they could stitch and bitch without devolving into a body-bashing session, shows an incredibly strong sense of positive body image among them. Great role models...and shopping buddies!

OK, I'm off like a prom dress. In the words of our beloved Vivian, "I have to go shopping now…”

Comments

Hi Leslie--I don't believe that the salewoman meant her comment in a derogatory way. When called on her comment, I am sure that she did acknowledge, not only her embarrassment, but also how she needed to work on her own self image. Sales staff--in all size departments, need to be non-judgemental.

I'm a plus-size myself, and I have to say that oftentimes I do feel discriminated against. The plus-sizes are always on the top floor of the department store, tucked into a corner somewhere (Old Orchard's Macy's was like this the last time I was there). Or someone from the dresses department is covering a shift in the plus-sizes and doesn't know anything about anything. And I abhore having to go into stores like Express or Abercrombie (or any other store where size 00 is the norm) to find gifts for my sister or niece. I consider myself lucky if I get a "Good Afternoon" from any one of those kids, much less anything resembling assistance. But the classic shopping episode story: I went into a specialty lingerie store for a bra for my above-average chest. The owner, a woman who is well into her eighties (as noted in all the newspaper clippings of herself posted all over the store), point blank looked at me and said, "I've got some great control top panties to help you with your battle of the bulge." Never went back

I walked into a little clothes store just to see what they have and the owner lady asked me if I wanted to see her bag collection since she only buys up to size 12........WTH? I wanted to whack her with MY bag over the head, but then all the stuff would fall out and I hate it when I get old lady on my bag.
But I've had some wonderful sales people, especially when I went bathing suit shopping, which is when you need a nice person the most, I think. She herself was a plus-size woman, so I think she understood my dilemma. But you can almost tell the kind of service you're going to get by the looks the sales people give you when you walk in. Some just disappear. Some won't make eye contact. Some say they're new. It's pretty sad.

Yeah, size 00 is ridic and I applaud those retail stores that recognize the full range of sizes that exists and put them all out in easy reach (NOT in the back of the store, like Monique pointed out - I live near Old Orchard and know what you're talking about!)

I happen to hate going to chi-chi boutiques because I tend to dress way down and I feel like those ladies are staring me up and down, judging me because I'm not wearing fancy jeans or couture heels.

Mia, "Old Lady On My Bag" would be an excellent name for a heavy metal band, agreed? :-)

Leslie, according to your bio you are someone who is very involved in working out & fitness, running etc , from your photo you are clearly in good shape. yet you sometimes seem to insinaute from your posts that its ok to be overweight. why do you not encourage people to get in shape like you are? if its ok to be heavy why do you work so hard to stay in shape? you understand the importance of it. the reason society is "down on" people who are grossly overweight is health issues. the same reason they are down on smokers. obesity ( if you are above a size large i think you are entering obese territory) can cause diabetes, joint problems, heart disease , cancer and all sorts of problems. you cant get operated on if you are too big, sleep problems, etc etc.
also I dont know where you live but i live in NYC. there are many nationalities here who naturally tend( with some exceptions obviously) to be really small people. ie the asians. so to them 00 is not "ridic" its their size. don't they deserve nice clothes too.

Cassie,

Not everyone is obese because they are lazy or gluttonous. My mom has gained almost 100 lbs. in the past year because she fell and developed severe knee problems. She went from being extremely active to not even being able to walk without a cane. She's only 59, but now has to look at different knee surgery options. And she deserves nice clothes and nice treatment in stores, and luckily she could really care less what some narrow-minded people think.

Also, you say you care about obesity because it's a health problem, yet when I think back to other posts you have made you talk about how women hate models in magazines because we're jealous of how fit they are and the fact that we don't put it in as much effort as they do. You've also said that you personally prefer a thin body to a larger one. So you'll excuse me if I don't think that health is your primary concern when talking about other people and their weight issues.

Cassie, you're correct that I take working out and eating healthfully seriously - both are important parts of my life. They make me feel good inside and out. But I would never make such a sweeping judgment such as "It's not OK to be overweight." Who am I to say this? Some people are sick, some are built in different ways and being "thin" is not natural for them. I think your statement that "Size Large" is "entering obese territory" is misguided. I recently bought a bathing suit at Target. Size large top, XL bottom. Am I obese? I am currently wearing a size L bathrobe. I wear size 12 pants from many stores...and size 8 at others. Not only does this demonstrate the irrationality of judging yourself by sizes, but imagine how frustrating it must be for women who are curvier (I mean, I'm a barely-B and I need a size L bikini top?!) and stores are carrying sizes that start at "00" (which, by saying "ridic," I meant, philosophically, it's ridiculous that Size 0 is not small enough in this society, we must go smaller!)

I definitely do encourage people to get in shape - not necessarily adopt the same exercise regimen as I employ, but that they do what works for them. I recently blogged about running skirts and then afterwards, wondered if it might have been off-putting for people who aren't so comfortable with their legs. But I'm just trying to promote the diversity that exists in both exercise and gear and get people excited.

As for your comment that "the reason society is 'down on' people who are grossly overweight is health issues, I wishwishwish I could agree with that - it would be wonderful if people were truly so concerned about their fellow humans' wellbeing. But my belief is people look down on overweight people because there has been a connection drawn between overweight and being lazy or having given up. Just look at how these women are portrayed in movies - often made fun of, put down or not viewed as attractive until they slim down. This is just simply not always true. As Nikki suggested, it may not be possible to

possible to run or lift weights for every woman. Some may be sick, some may be elderly. And some may simply enjoy a fuller figure. Also, many women do work out a lot and simply maintain a fuller figure. You ARE totally correct that obesity leads to a host of health problems, such as diabetes, cancer and heart disease. For these reasons, I encourage everyone to incorporate a healthy dose of exercise into their day. But I also try to think of myself as inclusive and open and want this to be a forum where all women feel welcome. I think it sucks that women like my mother's friend have to be so limited in their wardrobe, have to shlep to the back of department stores to find clothing, have to deal with society casting judgment on them. As I just posted last night, some kid on the street told me I have cankles - an insult crazy in many ways (though I do have thick ankles!) - and even just a comment as silly as that made me cringe. Imagine if someone on the street had called me/you/any of us wonderful, loving women "Fatass"

or something horrible like that? It happens. And it's sad.

BTW, you are right, people who are very tiny and need a size smaller than zero absolutely deserve clothes - I didn't mean to be sizeist and insinuate they do not. Thanks for calling me on it - I do need to be called on when I slip up!!!

A good friend of mine, who is a 10 or 12 (like those numbers aren't completely arbitrary) was nearly run out of a shop the other day. A sales women greated her at the door and said, oh, we don't carry anything in your size. !!!!!!

I have to jump in again... Cassie, if society were so concerned with the health issues of overweight people, or those of us who are obese at a size large according to your, um, philosophy shall we say, wouldn't those people ask us, "Why are you heavy?" before asking us where the next Twinkie sale is? Yes, being overweight does lead to several medical conditions, diabetes, heart disease, and so on. Just as medical conditions can also lead us to be obese, as it did me. Thyroid or other hormonal maladies, such as PCOS, can cause weight gain, too. And if you have a doctor who believes that you're an inactive over-eater and diagnoses you as such, you can spend years trying to lose the weight with little to no success because your body can't figure out how to regulate itself without meds. Can't get the meds without a doctor of course, and it leads to a very vicious cycle. Because again, if an obese persons' health was the major concern of society, a doctor would do everything they could to diagnose problems.

Leslie
Wonderful answer thank you. I hear your points. I guess I personally associate being overweight with laziness becuase for me in my body thats the case. I recently lost a lot of weight through diet and a LOT of exercise. I had originally put on all of the weight due to absolute laziness & gluttony. I tend to forget that some cases it maybe be medical so apologies to anyone who i offended. I guess i'm just a little obsessed with weight loss right now. However there are stores that cater to larger sizes solely. I too am different sizes in all stores i think thats just due to a bad sizing system. Ps to the people with bad knees etc - swimming is a no impact exercise that could help.

Hi --this is Leslie's mom and I concur
with Monique when she says that the plus sized sections are usually tucked away in a corner where one may feel that they are being 'put in the corner' for being a plus size. As I spoke with the saleswoman that made the "normal size' comment, she was embarrassed and apologetic and acknowledged that she, of all people, should not have uttered those words, that perhaps that was a reflection of how she felt about her own physical situation. Shopping for clothes can be such a frustrating and sad experience for those who may be suffering from physical issues. We are bombarded by what is the style of the day, and the expectations that once we buy the clothes, we will be happy. SOme salespeople will tell you that you look lovely, when you know darn well that you look like something the cat dragged in. Shopping with my daughter -back in the day--was a difficult and frustrating time--she was tall with long legs and could never find pants that she felt flattered her. Even my

my preschoolers have been known to comment -some negatively-to one another on the outfits they are wearing--they are 3 years old!! One of the funny stories about how we feel that we may not be as old as we are--I thought that the outfit I was wearing was attractive and quite in style when one of my moms from preschool asked me where I got my outfit--quite flattered, I told her and she said -good, I want to get it for my mom!! Whoa. Stay healthy everyone.

very good and interesting blog....